User talk:Amandelen

If you're here because of vandalism, please post your message here. Thank you =). Past conversations: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10

Basute-P
I can't seem to find any record of Basute-P having that name elsewhere. Their user name is Bosukete (ぼすけて) on Niconico and bskt on piapro, while Miku Wiki lists the name ボス走らず急いで歩いてきて僕らを助けてP. They were only active for a very short time a long time ago.

I'd like to change it to Bosukete, but I can't seem to find a way to rename a category. Do we delete it and add a new one? For now, I'll make a redirect to the original category, but I would prefer if we changed it. ElectricRaichu (talk) 23:53, March 23, 2019 (UTC)


 * Thank you for noticing! Unfortunately categories cannot be renamed, so we'll have to delete it and make a new one. I'll take care if it, though. Amandelen (talk) 00:07, March 24, 2019 (UTC)
 * I've made the new category. Amandelen (talk) 00:11, March 24, 2019 (UTC)

Thanks. BTW you can PM me on VocaDB. ElectricRaichu (talk) 10:10, March 24, 2019 (UTC)

My Friend Is A Dj
https://vocaloidlyrics.fandom.com/wiki/Down_The_Dark_Road

https://vocaloidlyrics.fandom.com/wiki/The_Journey Can you make the composer name linking work when you have time? :'D

Two language versions?
What happens when there are two versions of a song in different languages. In particular, Oyasumi no Uta has a Spanish version. Since the song has a Spanish title, do we create a separate page? Or do we use tabs on the Japanese page with a redirect from the Spanish title? ElectricRaichu (talk) 04:45, March 30, 2019 (UTC)

Thanks for the example page with tabs. I knew I'd seen one somewhere but I couldn't remember. The main thing I was thinking was that the English translations of the two versions might not be exactly the same, so it has to allow for separate translations, but the tabs handle it OK. ElectricRaichu (talk) 08:43, March 30, 2019 (UTC)

Coupe en Deux
The wiki article named "Coupe en Deux" ([//vocaloidlyrics.fandom.com/wiki/Coupe_en_Deux https://vocaloidlyrics.fandom.com/wiki/Coupe_en_Deux]) need to be deleted on the grounds of plagarism. ROBOTIQUE claimed to make the instrumental in their sing which isn't true. See: http://www.ourmusicbox.com/wp-content/music/free/150413_Temple_Of_Doom---free_download.mp3

MaitreyaMaikoa (talk) 04:46, March 30, 2019 (UTC)

sleepless nights
https://vocaloidlyrics.fandom.com/wiki/Sleepless_Nights

I added the lyrics tho the original SC upload was a short ver/not full lyrics, should it'd be edited to have both versions?

UTOPIA
https://vocaloidlyrics.fandom.com/wiki/Category:UTOPIA_songs_list Can you make the song pages link to the author?

Come True
[//vocaloidlyrics.fandom.com/wiki/Come_True https://vocaloidlyrics.fandom.com/wiki/Come_True]

Does this count as an 'original'? While KonranP did write the lyrics and do the tuning, 'jurrivh' is a pianist who posts 'free to use' instrumentals rather than someone who collabed with the composer directly. So at best it counts as a...I can't think of an alternate word for 'parody'? Or a remix, maybe. Compared to having it be completely a capella. (I think there are a couple songs like that on here as well but I can't think of others off the top of my head)~Angel


 * It's neither a remix nor a parody. It's an original song that uses music composed by jurrivh and lyrics by Konran-P. Sometimes songwriters write both the lyrics and the music. Often composers take lyrics written by someone else and write music for them. Often songwriters take music written by someone else and add their own lyrics to it. All three ways to write a song happen regularly. ElectricRaichu (talk) 00:51, April 2, 2019 (UTC)

Table for indicating parts
The guidelines recommend the following table for showing parts:

More recently, however, the following compact style has evolved:

Also, people often set the colours used in the table itself (i.e. not the vocalists) to match the info box, which I admit looks nicer.

Should we update the guidelines to recommend the new style? ElectricRaichu (talk) 01:02, April 2, 2019 (UTC)


 * Thank you for noticing! I'll update the guidelines. Amandelen (talk) 18:01, April 2, 2019 (UTC)

I rewrote the section to clarify some things. Could you please have a look see and what you think? ElectricRaichu (talk) 02:13, April 3, 2019 (UTC)


 * Looks good to me. Amandelen (talk) 18:29, April 3, 2019 (UTC)

mulmeyun
https://vocaloidlyrics.fandom.com/wiki/Category:Xirois_songs_list

https://vocaloidlyrics.fandom.com/wiki/Mulmeyun I think these two are the same person

Problem lyrics
As I suggested in this forum post, the majority of content is not a problem (at least I hope not), only some lyrics on some pages. Therefore I don't think it's necessary to move the entire wiki to another site. We just need to address the subset of pages that violate the Terms of Use.

Porting the wiki can be done in principle, but there'll be niggly issues all over the place, plus there are links to this site from other websites, plus there'll be a serious learning curve for everyone. We could create a new wiki to host just the explicit content we can't have here, but what sort of atmoshpere would it have, and who would manage it and what sort of people would it attract?

Now as far as VLW is concerned, we must remove all lyrics that we think would violate Fandom's Terms of Use, namely:


 * content that is obscene, pornographic, abusive, offensive, profane, or otherwise violates any law or right of any third party, or content that contains homophobia, ethnic slurs, religious intolerance, or encourages criminal conduct

I asked riipah, an admin on VocaDB whether they mind hosting explicit lyrics, and they replied that it's OK provided we tag it as explicit (there are plans to add filters), they're not illegal, and they're not too extreme (they reserve the right to delete anything that's over the top).

Therefore, while I'm open to suggestions, the best thing I can think of to do is to transfer lyrics of offending songs to VocaDB and just keep the metadata here. We can leave a note explaining why the lyrics are not presented. The usual link to VocaDB can remain as I can't see anything against it in the ToU, although we should not advertise that the lyrics are there. If somehow a song title itself is offensive we might have to delete it altogether.

Some issues I have: ElectricRaichu (talk) 07:29, April 4, 2019 (UTC)
 * Is it possible to censor parts of the lyrics if most of the song is OK? In that case we can still put the full lyrics on VocaDB.
 * The rules are open to interpretation. Particularly, what someone finds obscene, abusive, offensive or profane varies from person to person. I personally consider a single swear word profane, but most people wouldn't even care. On the other hand, while I dislike pornographic songs, they don't necessary upset me, but I know people who they would.

+IMPALE was censored and still got removed though, right? Isn't that the main song that started it? I know there's some songs out there that aren't really intentionally offensive, or just meant to be over the top as a 'joke'/shock value/meme-y songs~Angel

No, that song didn't start it, but it was the first time a Vocaloid song was removed so it's when we first noticed it. It has been going on for a while on LyricWiki, which has 2M+ songs. More recently, the latter has been closed to editing.

I poked around a bit and it seems that the reason that happened was that songs with explicit sexual, violent or racist lyrics and images were being removed by Fandom staff but were then added back by users (maybe even admins). In some cases, this process repeated more than once, frustrating Fandom's efforts. It seems images were censored before re-uploading, but unacceptable lyrics were restored intact. Mostly likely, Fandom staff were fed up with that sort of behaviour and decided to close the site to further editing. The site continues to exist, but now if a song gets removed, it can't be reinstated. The side effect is that new song lyrics can't be added either.

I think the source of the problem was a difference in philosophy. I suspect that LyricWiki had a philosophy of absolute free speech, while Fandom imposes limitations on what can be submitted because they and their adverstisers only want content that is safe and unhurtful for all ages, ethnicities, etc. I managed to identify a few songs that had been deleted and were reuploaded, and they were sexually explicit, violent or full of racism. Personally, I don't think Fandom were unreasonable in not wanting that sort of content.

As far as Vocaloid Lyrics Wiki and Vocaloid Wiki are concerned, so long as we take steps to remove content that violates the terms of service, and users don't try to reinstate material either we or Fandom staff delete, I think it's unlikely that we'll be closed down.

Note that offending content may include images as well as lyrics. I have seen one or two inappropriate images on here. I'll let you know if I come across them again but with so many songs they can be hard to find.

That raises another issue. We currently host thousands of songs. How do we check all of them? Is there a way to partition them among users who volunteer to check them all? What about songs in different languages that haven't been translated? Do we have people here who speak all the major languages in use?

I'd like to work out a procedure, something like (a) work through all song pages, (b) prepare a list of potentially problematic songs, (c) work through the list to decide what to do, i.e., retain, censor or remove, (d) move censored/deleted material to VocaDB while adding a suitable note here why the lyrics are deleted (and that they should not be reinstated). Could that be made to work?

ElectricRaichu (talk) 00:38, April 5, 2019 (UTC)

I just heard SPICE! for the first time since it's near the top of the explicit list. I'd never bothered before because I saw the "explicit" tag and I'm not into pornographic songs, but I skimmed through the words and I couldn't find anything that I would call explicit. So I changed the rating to questionable, but feel free to revert if you disagree. ElectricRaichu (talk) 01:32, April 6, 2019 (UTC)

In Yokkorasex, the translator has deliberately chosen to translate よっこらせ as "Good luck" and よっこらせっくす as "Good *uck" to preserve a play on words in the translation, but I can't see swearing in the original Japanese. The video shows two guys in unseemly poses but only for the sake of humour. I'll remove the swearing from the translation so at least that's not a problem. ElectricRaichu (talk) 21:47, April 6, 2019 (UTC)

I had a look at Sexcalibur -SEXCALIBUR- and I don't know whether it should be labelled explicit or suggestive. If it referred to actual body parts, then it would be explicit, but it uses metaphors instead. I think I should be able to translate it if you need. ElectricRaichu (talk) 23:26, April 7, 2019 (UTC)

Sakusen Kaishi! seems to be a humourous song about someone playing pranks on someone. There are a couple of semi-naked Kaitos in the video but I can't find anything in the lyrics. ElectricRaichu (talk) 02:23, April 8, 2019 (UTC)


 * Thank you (for all the analysis, not just the last one). I've updated the list I've been keeping with your commentary. I figured Sexcalibur was mostly metaphors, but I wasn't sure if the metaphors were commenly used for the body parts or not (which, IMO, would make it more explicit). I trust your judgement, so no need to translate it if you don't want to =). Amandelen (talk) 08:37, April 8, 2019 (UTC)


 * TBH I wouldn't know how common those metaphors are, but FWIW I haven't come across them before, so my guess is it's the lyricist being creative.
 * Are there any other songs I might be able to help with? ElectricRaichu (talk) 21:57, April 8, 2019 (UTC)

I think Kill Me should be downgraded to questionable rather than explicit. Although she repeatedly asks to be killed, it doesn't contain explicit descriptions of being killed. What do you think?

I downgraded 威風堂々 as I couldn't find anything I would consider too explicit. My take on the "fluid" in the second line is saliva, but feel free to reconsider.

I also downgraded 6.25 and JOKER since I found nothing explicit in the lyrics. There's some nudity in the video, but I'm not sure what we should do about that. For now I've put "Questionable: Nudity in video". ElectricRaichu (talk) 02:21, April 9, 2019 (UTC)


 * I agree with all the downgrading that you did, and I've downgraded キルミー (Kill Me) too. I'm still busy with spitting through the list (I think I did around 2/5th now?), so I'll let you know when I need second opinions. I took a break yesterday because I noticed that I was getting kind of "numb" to certain themes, so I decided to take a break of one day. I'll continue going through it today, though. Amandelen (talk) 17:55, April 9, 2019 (UTC)

I think eternal has been mistranslated. Well, maybe not, it's a matter of interpretation, but from the other lyrics I can't see why owari should be taken to mean the end of someone's life. Given that it mentions talk of eternal [love] and lies betrayed by averting their eyes, my take would be that it's the end of their relationship, and their "last party" is their last time with each other, not the literal last night of their lives. "Drowning" is metaphorical. I can't find anything that supports motoko's interpretation. We could ask for Damesukekun's opinion if you're unsure.

Satsujinloid. is black humour about a producer who has given up on the Vocaloid because they're looking for work (Miku version) or they got married (Kaito version), so in revenge the Vocaloid murders the producer. The violence in the lyrics is limited to "knife in chest", but I've left the explicit warning because the Kaito video is graphic (and even contains a warning as such at the start). ElectricRaichu (talk) 23:13, April 9, 2019 (UTC)  PS it was easy enough to translate if you want to check the lyrics.

I couldn't see why Atashi Baito!! ww is explict so I downgraded it. It seems to be limited to "I want to kill [certain people]". The video (skimming quickly) shows someone crazy with flashes of red but no actual violence. That's enough for me for today ... ElectricRaichu (talk) 00:05, April 10, 2019 (UTC)


 * Thank you for checking those! motoko has made a mistranslation before (Yanderenka), so I wouldn't be surprised if it was mistranslated tbh. If you can/want to correct it, feel free to go ahead. Otherwise we can also just remove it. Amandelen (talk) 20:38, April 10, 2019 (UTC)

OK, retranslated eternal and linked to a different sub that's more accurate. ElectricRaichu (talk) 03:07, April 11, 2019 (UTC)

I downgraded Night Worker, ハァハァしてる？, and SEX UNIT since the lyrics are not explicit.

I don't know about VAPOR CANNON because I feel like it's on the border, using metaphors and focusing on emotions, but still describing a sex act of some sort. Revolver is similar. Shall we finish dealing with onesc that are clear one way or the other, and afterwards get advice from Fandom on what to do with borderline ones?

I had a look at A Kyuu Haru Kisei strippeR-17 but I can't understand it either (maybe that's a good thing?). ElectricRaichu (talk) 01:08, April 13, 2019 (UTC)


 * Thank you for checking those. I agree with first doing the clear cut ones. For the borderline ones I'd rather ask other contributors for their opinion, or maybe look at similar songs that are still on Lyrics wiki (especially since I don't know if fandom has Japanese-speaking staff), but if it's really necessary we can ask fandom. Amandelen (talk) 17:12, April 13, 2019 (UTC)

OK. BTW I've been using the computer too much (on a Meiko project) and my RSI has flared up again so I might not be able to do much for a few days until it settles down. ElectricRaichu (talk) 00:20, April 14, 2019 (UTC)


 * No problem. Your health is more important than this, please take your time. Amandelen (talk) 07:33, April 14, 2019 (UTC)

I had a look at Kyuuketsu Aika. The description is not graphic, so I don't think it needs to be removed, but since the vampire cold-bloodely kills someone I personally think the warning should stay red.

SWING to SING doesn't seem so bad. There's lust but no profanity, and it doesn't seem explicit possibly apart from 舐めて which in context seems to be used metaphorically.

Sekai wa Oppai ni Michite Iru is a comical song, not an explicit one. Oppai is not profanity: "This is a kind of funny word, not like [deleted], but it’s still not exactly the best word to be walking around Tokyo yelling out" (Japanese Ammo). I've even heard it in children's anime. Get a second opinion if you like, but for now I'll downgrade the rating. ElectricRaichu (talk) 22:52, April 16, 2019 (UTC)

I think the warning on Mirai no Yomeru Dojikko should be altered to say "Nudity in video". I could be missing overtones but I couldn't find anything explicit in the lyrics.

I know it's satirical but The Story Of A Porn Watcher lyrics should be removed as that's exactly sort of thing Fandom were deleting on the other site! I probably wouldn't even wait when it comes to things that contain that much obscenity.

Uguisudani no Onna does involve sexual themes but the lyrics don't seem to be explicit. The warning should say something about the video, however, as it shows a used condom which I would regard as sexually explicit.

Finally for today, I agree that Brass Noise Flamenco is not a problem. Interesting that oppai is used in quite a coarse way (though I wouldn't consider it obscene). ElectricRaichu (talk) 10:45, April 18, 2019 (UTC)


 * Thank you for checking those! I've published the templates that were in my sandbox. I'm going to start organizing the pages I already checked a bit better and moving those that need to be moved. I'll also start adding a part about the new templates to the SAG and start drafting a community message to explain the new templates. Amandelen (talk) 16:34, April 18, 2019 (UTC)

French
When I type/search for "french" in the search bar, it links me to this page:

https://vocaloidlyrics.fandom.com/wiki/French_original_songs Rather than the category page, can you redirect it?


 * That seems to be a glitch, as other redirects (like producer names) also link to pages now. I'm guessing fandom will solve it soon enough. In the meantime, you should just click on the arrow on the right of the search bar to get the category. Amandelen (talk) 20:46, April 8, 2019 (UTC)

If you blocked?
If Amandalen blocks anonymous users, we should use ranged block for IP addresses, where it should use XXXX:XXXX:XXXX:XXXX/64 as lowest allocation for user blocking for IPV6 address, where IPV4 can use sub-allocation block as lowest allocation.

See. --Preceding comment signature by an anonymous user:2403:6200:8937:BDF3:D980:4966:2476:E2F0 00:44, April 11, 2019 (UTC)


 * I'm aware of range blocks (and I've used them in the past), but they should only be used sparingly to prevent false positives. Thank you for all the information, though! Amandelen (talk) 21:47, April 11, 2019 (UTC)
 * Well, admins should use /64 range block for IPv6 addresses to balance false positives within single IP block. --Preceding comment signature by an anonymous user: 171.97.97.172 06:45, April 12, 2019 (UTC)


 * I'm aware. Thanks again for the info, though! Amandelen (talk) 15:44, April 12, 2019 (UTC)


 * Don't aware too much on IPv6 /64 range block. The /64 range block is good for anonymous user with different addresses but the same subnets. See external link above. --Preceding comment signature by an anonymous user: 61.7.138.8 01:43, April 15, 2019 (UTC)

odd title
Rainy just added Take Off!! which seems fine, but you had recently added an almost identical song with a visually identical title, Take Off​!​!. There was no name clash, so I investigated it further. It seems that the song you added had invisible bytes in the title. See:

raichu@raichu-desktop:~$ od -bc Take Off!! 0000000 124 141 153 145 040 117 146 146 342 200 213 041 342 200 213 041         T   a   k   e       O   f   f 342 200 213   ! 342 200 213  ! 0000020 012         \n 0000021 raichu@raichu-desktop:~$ od -bc Take Off!! 0000000 124 141 153 145 040 117 146 146 041 041 012         T   a   k   e       O   f   f   ! ! \n 0000013 raichu@raichu-desktop:~$

The first is the title of the earlier song you added. Now you also know that my username on my home PC is raichu. I think probably the pages should be merged, but I'm curious how the invisible "342 200 213" bytes got in there. Any ideas?

There's a Take off! (Disambiguation) but I didn't add it because I wasn't sure what you want to do about the two pages.

ElectricRaichu (talk) 23:07, April 18, 2019 (UTC)

PS I found this and this article. It seems to be a zero-width space in UTF8 encoding and it has some typesetting uses. It's invisible, so it should not be in a song title as that is meant to be humanly readable. --Raichu


 * I think it might have happened because I copy-pasted the title from elsewhere (not sure if it was Bandcamp or VocaDB), while Rainy typed it out. I've made a redirect of the page that Rainy added, so it shouldn't cause problems in the future for that particular case. Amandelen (talk) 08:08, April 19, 2019 (UTC)

Actually, I think you should delete the page with the invisible characters. It's impossible to type the name in and will only confuse people and it's highly unlikely that a song title is meant to have invisible characters in it. ElectricRaichu (talk) 23:08, April 19, 2019 (UTC)


 * I've renamed the page to the name without invisible characters. Amandelen (talk) 06:32, April 20, 2019 (UTC)

From Hambeef68
Hey so I left a reply on my talk page on what you wrote.

Deleting images
I replaced the image on SECRET TIME with a generic one. Is it OK to go ahead and delete the original image? ElectricRaichu (talk) 07:13, April 20, 2019 (UTC)


 * She isn't nude in that image, but due to the color of her shirt it does look like that. Due to that I think it's better to just replace it. Feel free to delete the original image. Amandelen (talk) 07:14, April 20, 2019 (UTC)

Ha ha fooled me. It was hard to tell with the thumbnail.

Looked at some more songs
そして…嘔吐. (Soshite...Outo.) seems to involve unpleasantness and probably some kind of death. I don't properly understand it, but I can't find anything graphic or explicit about it, so maybe we can decrease the rating?

赤点先生 (Akaten Sensei) Yes the subject in the image is half-naked and also might be disturbing, so probably should replace it. The theme seems to be about an inappropriate teacher-student relationship so I think there should be some warning, but I couldn't see anything explicit.

炎の娘 (Honoo no Musume) The image contains nudity so I think that should be replaced. Otherwise, relying on the enlglish translation, I don't think there's profanity or anything obviously explicit, but again there are some metaphorically phrased though mild details. It's borderline but my feeling is that it's probably OK.

愛のコントローラー (Ai no Controller) My opinion is biased since it's one of my favourite songs, but the song is ostensibly about a musician's relationship with a musical synthesizer. It's cleverly worded so that there is a sexual interpretation (based on "soshite minna de", I could interpret it as a couple trying to conceive). Verse 2 line 4 is the only bit that might be considered explicit but there's no coarse language. What do you think?

I would put Hot Milk in the same category as ones like Vapor Cannon, i.e., it uses metaphors for the explicit details, so no idea what to do. Let's just continue keeping a list of them for now and deal with the obvious ones first.

ElectricRaichu (talk) 08:35, April 22, 2019 (UTC)


 * Thank you for checking those! I personally think Ai no Controller can stay because it contains no coarse language (as you said), and it's not too in your face about it. I've replaced the images you mentioned. Amandelen (talk) 08:51, April 22, 2019 (UTC)

Daisangenland
https://vocaloidlyrics.fandom.com/wiki/%E3%82%A6%E3%82%A7%E3%83%AB%E3%82%AB%E3%83%A0%E3%83%BB%E3%83%88%E3%82%A5%E3%83%BB%E3%82%B6%E3%83%BB%E5%A4%A7%E4%B8%89%E5%85%83%E3%83%A9%E3%83%B3%E3%83%89_%28Welcome_to_the_Daisangenland%29

"熱烈歓迎打" isn't translated or missing (unless it's b/c the translator's only JP to english and doesn't know any chinese)


 * Seems to me like the translator doesn't know Chinese. I've added a WIP template. Amandelen (talk) 14:17, April 24, 2019 (UTC)

Shaker
https://vocaloidlyrics.fandom.com/wiki/Category%3AShaker_songs_list

https://vocaloidlyrics.fandom.com/wiki/SHAKER Can you make a disambiguation page for these?

White station
https://vocaloidlyrics.fandom.com/wiki/White_station

This song has a JP ver i don't think the lyrics are transcribed on piapro tho


 * I've found them on piapro. I'll add them soon. Amandelen (talk) 18:21, April 26, 2019 (UTC)

kma
https://vocaloidlyrics.fandom.com/wiki/%E6%98%8E%E6%97%A5%E3%81%AB%E3%81%AF%E3%80%81%E6%B6%88%E3%81%88%E3%81%A6%E3%82%86%E3%81%8F_(Ashita_ni_wa,_Kiete_Yuku)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gO_cqCyPslc Yuki's added English CC to her song now :)

searching multiple categories
hi there! this is kind of related to this forum post - apparently there's a function to add a special page for searching pages with multiple categories, but you need to contact Fandom staff in order to do it. (I also think you need to be an admin?)

would it be possible to have that special page here on VLW? thank you!

Space Zinnia 19:21, April 27, 2019 (UTC)


 * I'll look into it. Might take a few days, though. Amandelen (talk) 20:24, April 27, 2019 (UTC)


 * thanks for looking into it. for some reason CatNav doesn't work for me...? it takes me to a broken link saying the page doesn't exist :( Space Zinnia 21:30, April 27, 2019 (UTC)


 * Weird. I'll ask staff about Category Intersection then. Amandelen (talk) 08:30, April 28, 2019 (UTC)

Question for Cover songs
Hello,

Why are there no 'VOCALOID_name cover songs'; because calling it "original" is contracting the purpose of the category. -- Bunai Di (talk) 18:38, April 28, 2019 (UTC)

Oliver
[//vocaloidlyrics.fandom.com/wiki/Gay_Sex_Original_Song https://vocaloidlyrics.fandom.com/wiki/Gay_Sex_Original_Song] Should this be removed completely too or are the censors fine?


 * I think the lyrics should be removed. I think it goes to far just to be censored. ElectricRaichu (talk) 03:39, April 29, 2019 (UTC)


 * I also think it's too explicit. I've removed the lyrics. Amandelen (talk) 16:17, April 29, 2019 (UTC)